Labor euphoric over passage of paid family leave, while Lonegan fumes

Initial cost bill will be $33/person, or $66 per working couple.  But govenrment always underestimates and before you know it, this act will cost you hundreds of dollars annually.

Guess another ten thousand people are one step closer to leaving NJ.

The man who reads nothing at all is better educated than the man who reads nothing but newspapers. - Thomas Jefferson

We all have to bite the bullet when a family member is sick. It is not easy and many families have a hard ship.

 But another government program is not the answer!!

 NJ has enough government programs on the books already. Isn't that the reason we are broke?

 This is another example of politicians taking a sad and emtionally charged issued and using it for political gain.

People have responsablities to to help their families, not employers. No matter how hard we try the State  cannot make life's problems go away. The politicians in NJ only seem to ad to them.

The world is a hard place and we all have crosses to bear, but the State of NJ has moved another step to socialism and the public can't afford to be taxed any more as we all know.

Just another feel good piece of legislated payroll  tax designed to pit rich against poor in the next election cycle, voted yes today by 22 gutless politicians.

You and your anti-family rhetoric got beat today and New Jersey is a better place for it. You will always be a fringe person in this State and by taking stands against Bills such as this you simply place  yourself further and further away from the taxpayers of this State.

THIS IS A GREAT DAY FOR NEW JERSEY!! 

You were in a Union so you made a good salary. Many people are not unionized and they need a bill like this to help them out. You had it tough, and I am sorry that you did, but does that mean everyone else has to have it tough just because you did?

Don't be so bitter. This Bill will cost you next to nothing each week. Don't deny others what you could not have when you went through your tough times. 

As for Lonegan, he is a side show for those who enjoy his kind of act. But he is not a major player, even in his own Party. Follow him at your own risk.    

Wow!

A tech person I know is designing a multi-server website to assist New Jersey businesses in relocating to neighboring states, outsourcing labor to other states or overseas. In the past I was giving him a hard time for mentioning it, but now I can't. It will be on-line by the end of March to mid-April.

From what he says, it will be a very simple, "Yes, you can do it and I'll show you how" type of website. He said it will have all the steps needed to outsource or relocate a business, document links, estimators on how much money will be saved and links to various support sites and government pages that will actually show how the company can get federal funding for offshoring labor.

He says that the typical relocation to PA nets a 15% labor savings and Delaware is around 20-25%. What's more important is that if you move more than 50 miles away, 80% of the workforce either won't follow or will quit in less than 1 year. This does not include the monies saved by lower tax bases, lower cost per sq. ft of buildings and reduced administrative and regulatory burdens.

If outsourcing is your game, well that's even better. Russia is a 60-70% reduction and India is over 75% reduction in labor costs. 

Apparently, many companies are not aware of what is required or think that this task is too daunting. He says that the typical company can be relocated within 20-45 days from inception time. The ROI is generally less than 1 year.

John Adler & Bill Baroni are in good company.

Soon they will have 20,000 bumper stickers distributed around their district from the bumtag site. Also, there are instant electronic downloads. That should be good for Adler's congressional run.

Also, as time allows, I will be contacting every company who 'contributed' to each of the NJ legislators. I'm sure they will be happy to find that the money that they 'contributed' for their candidates went to help increase their management and staffing costs. I wonder how fast the vote will be rammed through the Assembly?

This information is at:

http://www.elec.state.nj.us/ElecWeb/contribStandardSearch.aspx

   Those who say this costs next to nothing dont' realize that soon they'll be robbing our pay checks of hundreds of dollars in coming years for a redundant program that less than one percent of the population will ever qualify to benefit from.   And if anyone protests they'll be labeled anti-family.  The Federal Government is giving us free money because the economy is crap and here we have our NJlegislators taking straight from our paychecks to pay for some ultra liberal program that 10 people a year might benefit from.

You have to use all your sick and vaction days to get paid leave to begin with  and many  who take this leave will have no guarentee of getting their job back.   Hows' that month and a half off looking NOW?   Thanks for Nothing Sweeny! Rot in hell!

Yep.

As New Jersey is leading the nation as the number one relocator, outsourcing and offshoring will soon follow. Transfer the labor portion to another state or country and all of these worries goes away. Once the labor portion goes, there's no benefit in keeping the corporate offices here either.

Business owners, ask yourself "What are the benefits of working in New Jersey?" and "How much grief and finances would I save if I went somewhere else?".

RELOCATE, OUTSOURCE & OFFSHORE - Save 25-75% on Labor, administration and office space. The act of doing this is extremely simple, it just takes the desire to say "What am I doing here, banging my head against the wall everyday? Nothing is going to change unless I make it change."

There's nothing left in New Jersey.

RELOCATE, OUTSOURCE & OFFSHORE

RELOCATE, OUTSOURCE & OFFSHORE

RELOCATE, OUTSOURCE & OFFSHORE

We had 8 murderers on NJ death row who killed and raped women and children and one of whom murdered again while in prison, thanks to endless appeals.  NJ voted for the death penalty but Corzine abolished it without allowing it on the ballet, scared NJ wouldn't vote the way he wanted. 

In Texas crime dropped 60% thanks to the death penalty  

I have no problem with marriage equality. That's the only liberal position I take.  The rest of what liberals want is rubbish.

Labor has a right to ask or demand more benefits.

Just remember that in a global economy. You know the same one where you buy stuff at Target and Wal-Mart because it's cheaper, but it is of foreign content and puts americans out of work, yet you disclaim that because you need the money and say "It's not that much money." or "Look at what I'm saving!" or "Gee, I really NEED a new plasma TV."

Well, labor is cheaper in other countries or regions of this country. As the disparity between your total employee costs widen from those of other areas, sooner or later business can't ignore those costs differences. Remember, a company know exactly how much each employee costs to keep, to the penny. The buildings and governmental costs are also factored. After seeing the numbers, some exceeding 80% cost reductions, I can no longer be a protectionist. I am in favor of relocation, outsourcing and offshoring.

Business has the right to relocate, outsource or offshore just as you have the right to try and place more burdens on them. Perhaps when the jobs start drying up, employees will realize that they need a job before the benifits.

Don't complain when your job goes to New Delhi.

I think employers can work with employees that have real trumatic family problems. I think thats how we've gotten by thus far. Paid leave  just puts employr and employee at odds with one another.  If someone uses all their vaction leave and sick time and still needs a month and a half off I'd say 9 times out of ten it won't be a legitmate need.  I  forsee people intending on quiting their job who get paid leave and never return to work.

Yeah, New Jersey leads, right down the toilet!   More jobs will be going out of this state, and the only people left will be the drug addicts, state employees and corrupt politicians. 

"The only man who never makes a mistake is the man who never does anything."
                --Theodore Roosevelt--

As our "leaders" rearrange the deck chairs on the Titanic, we should make it a priority to expand mass transportation service from PA to NJ to NYC in order that we the people can make our exodus across the mighty Delaware to the promised land.  I can't think of a better use of my tax dollars given that the ship of state is sinking fast.  Go west, young man! 

As far as Baroni goes, you've ensured a lifetime tenure in the State Senate in your legislative district by your vote.  Congratulations.  On the other hand, you will NEVER win state-wide office as a Republican.  Then again, life is a series of trade-offs. 

Last thing i will say is that there's no way NJ voters would have voted themselves a payroll tax that goes up every year

It's starting already...

www.newjerseystinks.com

www.outsourcenewjersey.com

The Bill is going to become law so just get over it.

To the poster who keeps wanting to out source his businees . Fine, Go ahead , get your workers from New Delhi. New Jersey will survive and prosper without you.

To the anti-family crowd, . Sorry, but you are going to have to find another way to make people choose between their families and their employers demands.

New Jersey will continue to do well, with or without all you naysayers.

Finally, stop threatening to leave. Either make this State better or hit the road. Someone will take your place. New Jersey will alwasy be a good place to make money.  

P.S. Take the whining Lonegan with you.  

Must have missed the " always" .  Believe it or not I am not a Liberal. Moderate, not liberal. This Bill, by the way,  was introduced by a moderate Democrat who battled the State Worker Unions to a draw. That is something the great Lonegan has never attempted to do.

I do believe that government has a role in helping people when it can. But not at the expense of others.

You see, that is where you anti-family paid family leave haters lose your argument. The Worker pays, the Worker takes the needed benefit only under certain circumstances, and the businees has an employee who is grateful and thankful. THERE IS NO TAX BEING IMPOSED ON THE BUSINESS OWNER. The paid leave time is very limited, only 6 weeks TOTAL.

It is time to stop crying. It is going to happen. It will be good for everyone. NOT ONE SINGLE BUSINESS WILL GO OUT OF BUSINESS BECAUSE OF THIS BILL.

I am in a hurry so can you pleasse speel chck my pst agin?

First Amdment,  there are so many disqualifiers attached to paid family leave that few will ever take advantage of it. That is what Corzine and other state officals are banking on. 

It is insurance...  And how do insurence companies make money?  By limiting their number of claims!  The state government will making money off this scam called paid family leave and they can use it to fill gaps in the state buget and other such nonsense like paying for underfunded state pensions  which has nothing to do with helping families.

  And a huge segment of the population who work for small business, simply won't take it because they won't get their jobs back.  so no, it won't be good for everyone.  The government will rake in the the dough, and use the surplus from paid leave won't benefit anyone but the self serving state government. they sold you a feel good idea.  Do you still feel good, or do you feel a little like a sap?  

You haven't answered my question:  If this is such a great idea, why not make it voluntary?  And why should I pay into a fund for a benefit I will never collect?

Panama: For the death penalty and other such matters, I'm not sure a ballot and initiative is the correct answer. Ballot and initiative, which costs millions to implement, as with the latest ones Schwarzenegger pushed through in Calif., would have meant that the majority of Americans would have voted against integrated schools in the 50s and 60s, and other terrible matters. Also, an argument that uses a slippery slope, "if x happens, then y," is not the most plausible one to make, since these are notoriously unreliable. When Paid Family Leave is implemented, businesses will not face unnecessary restrictions and would rather give workers what should be the norm: Basic rights to care for loved ones or themselves in the case of an emergency -- without the fear that their employer would use that against them and fire them. This is on the employee's dime, not the employer's, and provides only the most basic of rights. I would agree, however, that this needs to be implemented regionally -- in Pa., Del. and N.Y. -- for greater uniformity in employment standards.

And PoliticsSJ's (check your private messages, btw) response, that this should merely be voluntary for businesses, is rather naive. Many, but not all, businesses wouldn't have unions, worker rights, environmental standards or anything of the sort unless it was mandatory (hence, my strong belief in a system of checks and balances in the private sector, too). This is why, for example, we need tough emissions standards on polluting companies since these industries won't regulate themselves.

Having just read some studies on the California version of PFL (Paid Family Leave), I noted one UCLA economist found that those companies that already had PFL actually had saved money in the long run because of a) employee retention and satisfaction and b) saving money from training new employees.

The bill is nothing more than a socialist scheme to have government control individual's lives.  This is something that all of you communists love, tell everyone else what to do.  It has nothing to do with family, but everything to do with the liberals like yourself who take from hard working people to give to the drug addicts and lazy bums you think are your power base.

"The only man who never makes a mistake is the man who never does anything."
                --Theodore Roosevelt--

Don’t give yourself credit for this bill passing. You have nothing to do with this at all. You may gloat at the fact that this bill is being passed due to political payoffs and the weakness of our legislature, but you had nothing to do with it. There haven’t been too many supporting your position on this thread lately,  much like the Governor’s Toll Road Proposal. Perhaps the other union supporters of this bill have realized that maybe this bill has finally ‘jumped the shark’ and feel it’s wise to be quiet as there may be consequences to its actions?

Yes, business may be unable to stop this bill from going in, but a least we are trying to express the impact of this bill instead of blindly towing the state employee - AFSCME party line. Your job is protected for the moment, until new state administration comes into power. We know it won’t be Corzine, so you better pray that Codey gets in. However, in a couple years, based on the spiral this state's executive branch is in, that probably won’t happen.

We, the business owners will actually have the last laugh. Hopefully, we’ll be able to cause a good enough of a labor downturn that state cuts will be unavoidable. Layoffs and job freezes are in the future and what better than to blame it on a poor economy. I'm sure this bill's supporters won't admit that this bill had anything to do with an employment downturn. With a downturn comes lack of revenue for the state and a bigger deficit. Hopefully, your peasant job is low on the state's totem pole. I know you can’t be too high on the list due to your poor writing skills and limited scope of thought - definately a worker bee or a cockroach (they survive until being stepped on). Sooner or later the state axe is coming.

The thing that worries me is that, if most people who take this plan are pregnant workers, many employers might start screening the female workforce. Those women who are in childbearing age might feel the brunt of this bill, as they may be candidates for taking one or two events during their employment. But you’re not a women so why would you care? In a small shop, if there isn’t enough money in the company’s pool, the unemployment tax rate goes up for the employer to replenish the deficit. Also, they will loose the worker for periods at a time. This will actually be a direct assault on single or married younger women and those families you are 'trying' to protect – like it for not younger families and older families may take a direct hit. Business greedy or not – it comes down to the small employer feeding his family or someone else’s. Guess what? Someone else's looses every time. Bigger companies may absorb it or have an unwritten code that quietly looks for 'better skilled' employees.

In any event, write the date of this bills passage and mark it on next year’s calender. The "I told you so" is coming.  

Enjoy.

Yep! I’ve secured my office space in Pennsy. I’ll be relocated there in early May, once the office space is available. This is a done deal. I’m just working out a few final details. There appears to be only about 20 employees following me. I’m still living in Jersey for the meantime. There are emotional decisions and business decisions. Only successful business people make business decisions. This decision was a cumulative result - brought on by not just one burden but dozens of them. New Jersey does not offer any business advantages – none!

The net result is that I will have an immediate 5% increase in workable money. In a little over a year, this will be triple to quadruple that value. Gone are also higher salaries that are needed to be paid - a negative COLA. I couldn’t promote the idea of moving out without researching it. Once doing so, all the pieces fell into place and the stars aligned. What I pay in turnpike tolls will be all but a memory. It’s time to go to Disney this summer!

I will continue to fight for my business bretheren who are in the same boat as me and help to promote the exodus from New Jersey.

 Thank heaven for PFL, State Debt and this stupid Toll Road scheme, they finally forced me to say “Enough is Enough”.

First, I don't check nor do I know how to access the private contact, so don't even try.

In 1913, the federal income tax was relatively innocuous, too.  It was a 2% tax on the top 5% of all wage earners.  That's pretty much stayed the same, hasn't it?

When the bridges to Philly were built, the tolls were only supposed to last 10 years until the bonds were paid off.  Well, tolls keep going up. 

My point is, this will also be abused.  It will be funded, then politicians will look for ways to spend it and place IOUs into the account. 

And Martin, the only "fairness" a business owner owes an employee is a negotiated wage and benefits package, and that's all.  If the employee doesn't like it, get out and work somewhere else or start your own business.  If you don't like working for the man, BE the man. 

You treat businesses as the enemy and that's the problem.  You cited a California study that showed businesses that already had paid FSL stood to save.  That means some business owners saw teh value of FSL and retained good employees.  But the rest of the businesses should not be forced to follow suit.  Martin, your brand of socialism has not worked anywhere in the world.  But you cling to the hope that your brand of socialism just hasn't had the right people in charge.   

This program is not really out there to help the low-income employee or the ones who work for small business. No one really cares about them. This bill is really out there to serve the state's unions and other large union establishments – the big corporate non-union employees just happen to get a free ride due to their size. The small business employees would never be able to take advantage of this plan. It’s just a feel good type of clause so that ALL of the employees in this state would subsidize the larger company and union employees so that they could take their events, probably on a yearly basis.

It this were a serious bill, there would be much verification that would be required to take an event, not just a note from one’s podiatrist. Yes, your podiatrist can write you out for an event. And how ambiguous is the ‘Emotional Support’ clause? There is no real verification being performed. Also, I believe that the employee can take the State PFL and then the Federal Family Leave back to back. This would give 18 weeks of outage per event. Of course the Federal bill does require verification, but some union contracts skate around them.

 This whole bill is a sham. It’s written, not by hacks, but by extremely cunning people who know exactly how to write the proper loopholes in a measure. Yes, this bill was written as planned and passed as such. When you look at this bill, I mean really read an decipher this bill, it’s a total POS.